Discussion:
For, sins so sweet,
(too old to reply)
Arthur Neuendorffer
2018-02-17 14:18:44 UTC
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Raw Message
-------------------------------------------------------
I first got excited about Oxfordian ciphers from reading about two amazing
(anonymous) near anagrams in John Michell's book _Who Wrote Shakespeare_:
------------------------------------------------
. OUR EVER-LIVIN(g)
. VERO NIL VERIU(s)

and:

. ENVIOU(s) SLIVER
. NIL VE(r)O VERIUS
------------------------------------------------
. . Hamlet (Quarto 2, 1604) Act 4, Scene 7
.
Queen: There is a Willow growes ascaunt the Brooke
. That showes his horry leaues in the glassy streame,
. Therewith FANTASTIQUE gaRLANDs did she make
. Of Crowflowers, Nettles, Daises, and long Purples
. That liberall Shepheards giue a *GROS(s)ER NAME* ,
. But our cull-cold maydes doe dead mens fingers call them.
. There on the pendant boughes her *CRONET WEEDES*
. Clambring to hang, an *ENVIOU(s) SLIVER* broke,
. When downe her weedy trophies and her selfe
. Fell in the weeping Brooke, her clothes spred wide,
. And Marmaide like awhile they bore her vp,
. Which time she chaunted snatches of old laudes,
. As one incapable of her owne distresse,
. Or like a creature natiue and indewed
. Vnto that elament, but long it could not be
. Till that her garments heauy with theyr drinke,
. Puld the poore wretch from her melodious lay
. To muddy death.
..................................................
*GROS(s)ER NAME* : *ENVIOU(s) SLIVER*
*ROGE(r) MANERS* : *NIL VE(r)O VERIUS*
----------------------------­-------------­-----------
But it dawned on me that [the Roper] array also contains
an "ENVIOUS SLIV(ER)":
-----------------------------------------------------
.TERRATEGITPOPULUSM Æ R E T O L Y M P U S H A B E T
.....................................................
.STAYPASSENGERWHYGO E S T T H O U B Y S O F A S T R
.EADIFTHOUCANSTWHOM [E N V I O U S]D E A T H H A T H
.PLASTWITHINTHISMON [U]M E N T{S H A K S P E A R E}W
.ITHWHOMEQUICKNATUR [E|D]I D E{W H O S E N A M E D}O
.THDeCKYSTOMBEFARMO [R|E]t H E N C O S T S I E H A L
.LYTHEHATHWRITTLEAV [E S L I V]I N G A R T B U T P A
.GETOSERVEHISWITT
-----------------------------------------------------
I believe that Oxford wrote the (self referential) Hamlet 1603 Quarto
while others (including Rutland & Lord STRANGE) improved upon it for
the 1604 Quarto. After Rutland died in 1612 William Stanley honored
Roger Manners in Hamlet's letter:
----------------------------­-------------­-----------
1623 Folio (Act 4, Scene 7)
Claudius reads Hamlet's letter to Laertes:

'High and mighty, You shall know I am set naked on
your kingdom. To-morrow shall I beg leave to see
your kingly eyes: when I shall, first asking your
pardon thereunto, recount the occasion of my sudden

*AND MORE STRANGE RE(t)URN*.' 'HAMLET.'
......................................
_ *AND MORE STRANGE RE(t)URN*
_ *ROGER MANNERS, E. RUT(l)AND*
---------------------------------------------------
Neufer wrote:

<<However, since John de Vere [13th Earl] helped Richmond become Henry VII
(and thus start the House of Tudor) Elizabeth was OK with him being recognized
in Shakespeare (along with Sir William Stanley: the ancestor of William
Stanley, 6th Earl of Derby: Edward de Vere's son-in-law and probably
coauthor of the [W.S]hakespeare canon).
......................................................
Lea wrote:

<<There is no more evidence of William Stanley's involvement
in the Shakespeare canon than there is of Edward de Vere's, Art.>>

There is *MORE* cipher evidence of [W]illiam [S]tanley's involvement
in the Shakespeare canon than there is of Edward de Vere's, Dave:
-----------------------------------------------------------
Was *THOMAS LODGE* the *PAGE* that served W.S.'s WIT?
........................................................
Job 31:32 The *STRANGER* did no{T LODGE} in the street:
. but I opened my doores to the trauailer.
-------------------------------------------------------
Ben Jonson (1623) _To the Memory of Shakespeare_
.............................................
My Shakespeare, rise; I will no{T LODGE} thee by
Chaucer, or Spenser, or bid Beaumont lye
A little further, to make thee a roome :
Thou art a Moniment, without a TOMBe,
.............................................
Shine *FORTH*, thou Starr{E O}f Poets, and wi[T|H} rage,
Or inf[L]uence, chide, [O]r che{E}re the [D]rooping Sta[G]e;
Which, si{N}c[E] thy flight frõ hence, hath mou{R}n'd like night,
And despaires da{Y}, but for thy Volumes light.
.............................................
. <= 11 =>
.
. S h i n e*F O R T H* t
. h o u S t a r r{E O} f
. P o e t s,a n d w i [T]
. {H}r a g e.O r i n f [L]
. u e n c e,c h i d e,[O]
. r c h e{E}r e t h e [D]
. r o o p i n g S t a [G]
. e;W h i c h,s i{N}c [E]
. t h y f l i g h t f r õ
. h e n c e,h a t h m o
. u{R}n'd l i k e n i g
. h t,A n d d e s p a i
. r e s d a{Y}
.
[T LODGE] 11 : Prob. at end of poem ~ 1 in 19 ,000
{HENRY} 26 : Prob. at end of poem ~ 1 in 185
..................................................
(Shortest positive ELS [T LODGE] skip in KJV = 25)
-----------------------------------------------------------
http://internetshakespeare.uvic.ca/Library/facsimile/book/SLNSW_F3/13/
Prefatory Materials (Folio 3, 1664)

A Catalogue of all the Comedies, Histories,
and Tragedies contained in this Book.
............................................
Tragedies.

Troylus and Cressida.
The Tragedy of Coriolanus.
Titus Andronicus.
Romeo and Juli[E]t.
Timon of Athens.
The Tra[G]edy of Jul. Caes.
The Trage[D]y of Macbeth.
The Tragedy [O]f Hamlet.
The Tragedy of K. [L]ear.
The Moor of Venice.
An[T]hony and Cleopatra.
The Tragedy of Cymbeline.
............................................
. <= 21 =>
.
. T r o y l u s a n d C r e s s i d a.T h e
. T r a g e d y o f C o r i o l a n u s.T i
. t u s A n d r o n i c u s.R o m e o a n d
. J u l i [E] t.T i m o n o f A t h e n s.T h
. e T r a [G] e d y o f J u l.C a e s.T h e T
. r a g e [D] y o f M a c b e t h.T h e T r a
. g e d y [O] f H a m l e t.T h e T r a g e d
. y o f K.[L] e a r.T h e M o o r o f V e n i
. c e.A n [T] h o n y a n d C l e o p a t r a.
. T h e T r a g e d y o f C y m b e l i n e.

[T.LODGE] -21 : Prob. in "Tragedies" ~ 1 in 1100
-----------------------------------------------------------
http://pages.uoregon.edu/rbear/muses.html

. THE TEARES OF THE MUSES (1591) BY ED. Sp.
. (dedicated to *[ALICE S]PENCER*, Countess of Derby)
.......................................................
. All places th{EY} with follie have possest,
. And with vaine toyes the vulgar[E] entertaine;
. But me have banished, with all the rest
. That whi[L]ome wont to wait upon my traine,
. Fine Counterfesaunce and {U}[N]hurtfull Sport,
. Delight and Laughter deckt in seemly sor{T}.
.[A]ll these, and all that els the comick stage
. With seasoned wi[T] and goodly pleasance graced,
. By which mans life in his like[S]t image
. Was limned *FORTH*, are wholly now defaced;
. And those s[W]eete wits which wont the like to frame
. Are now despizd, and made a laughing game.
. And he, the man whom Nature selfe had made
. To mock her selfe, and *TRUTH* to imitate,
. With kindly counter under *MIMICK SHADE* ,
. Our p{LE(a)SANT WILLY}, ah! *IS DEAD* of late:
. With whom all joy and jolly meriment
. Is also deaded, and in dolour drent.
...................................................
. p{LE(a)SANT WILLY}
. {WILL STANLEY}
.......................................................
______ <= 49 =>
.
. Allplacest h {E/Y} withfolliehavepossestAndwithvainetoy
. esthevulga r [E] entertaineButmehavebanishedwithallthe
. restThatwh i [L] omewonttowaituponmytraineFineCounterf
. esaunceand {U}[N] hurtfullSportDelightandLaughterdeckti
. nseemlysor {T}[A] lltheseandallthatelsthecomickstageWit
. hseasonedw i [T] andgoodlypleasancegracedBywhichmansli
. feinhislik e [S] timageWaslimnedFORTHarewhollynowdefac
. edAndthose s [W] eetewitswhichwonttheliketoframeArenow
. despizdand m a dealaughinggame
.
[W.STANLE/Y}] -49 :
Prob. near to {Our p-LE(a)SANT WILLY} ~ 1 in 32,000
---------------------------------------------------
*TELLESTICKS* found by Jones Harris & John Rollett
............................................................
The Names of the *26* Principall Actors in all these Playes.

[William Shakespeare]
Richard B(ū)rba(D)ge.
John Hemmings.
Augusti(ñ)e Phillip [S].
William Kemp [T].
Thom(ā)s Poop (e).
George Brya (N).
Henry C(O)n[D]el [L].
W(I)l(L)iam S(L) (Y|E).
{R}ichard Cowl [Y].
John Low(I)ne.
Samuell Crosse.
A(L|E]xander Co(O)k{E}.
---------------------------------------------------------------
*STONE*, n. [OE. ston, *STAN*; akin to OS. & OFries. *STEN*,
D. *STEEN*, G. stein, Sw. *STEN*, Dan. *STEEN*, Gr. a pebble.]
..........................................................
Prob. of 'St(e)nley' or 'St(a)nley' ~ 1 in 2,500,000
.................................................................
Prob. (at least) 6 of the 7[ST(e)NLEY] guys were Lord *STRANGE's*
Men while only (at most) 3 of the other 19 PA's were ~ 1 in 450
----------------------------------------------------------------
Source: http://tinyurl.com/lju45g7
https://archive.org/stream/poeticalworksofw00bass#page/114/mode/2up
.
. ELEGY ON SHAKESPEARE,
. From Lansdowne MS.(777) TEMP. James I.
......................................................
. On Mr. Wm. Shakespeare
. HE DYED IN APRILL 1616
.
. Renowned Spencer lye a thought more nye
. To learned Chaucer, and rare Beaumond lye
. A little neerer Spenser, to make roome
. For *SHAK{E}SPEARE* in your threefold, fowerfol{D} Tombe.
.(To LODGE) all fowre in one bed m{A}ke a shift
. Untill Doomesdaye, for ha{R}dly will a sift
. Betwixt ys day and yt {B}y *FATE* be slayne,
. For whom your Curta{I}nes may be drawn againe.
. If yoUr prec{E}dency in death doth barre
. A *FOURTH* place in your sacred sepulcher,
. Under this carved marble of thine owne,
. Sleepe, rare Tragœdian, Shakespeare, sleep alone;
. Thy unmolested peace unshared Cave,
. Possesse as Lord, not Tenant, of thy Grave,
. That unto us & others it may be
. Honor hereafter to be layde by thee.

- Wm. Basse
.....................................
_______ <= 30 =>
.
. For*SHAK{E}SPEARE* inyourthreefoldf
. owerfol {D} TOMBE ToLODGEallfowrein
. onebedm {A} keash iftUntillDoomesda
. yeforha {R} dlywi llasiftBetwixtysd
. ayandyt {B} yFATE beslayneForwhomyo
. urCurta {I} nesma ybedrawnagaineIfy
. oUrprec {E} dency indeathdothbarreA
. FOURTHp l acEin yoursacredsepulcher
.
{E.DARBIE} 30 : Prob. ~ 1 in 10,300
..........................................................
http://quod.lib.umich.edu/e/eebo/A12017.0001.001?view=toc

<<The most lamentable Romaine tragedie of Titus Andronicus
As it was plaide by the right honourable the {E}arle of {DARBIE},
*Earl of PEMBROOKE* , and Earl of Sussex their seruants.

London: Printed by Iohn Danter, and are to be sold by
Edward White & Thomas Millington, at the little North
doore of Paules at the signe of the Gunne, 1594.>>
.....................................................
(Shortest positive ELS {DARBIE} skip in KJV = 33)
---------------------------------------------------
http://www.bartleby.com/331/186.html
.
. Rosalynde (1590) by *THOMAS LODGE*
_Phoebe's Sonnet, a Reply to Montanus' Passion_

When Love was first begot,
And by the *moVER's WILL*
Did fall to human lot
His solace to fulfil,
Devoid of all deceit,
A chaste and holy fire
Did quick[E]n man's conce[I]t,
And women's [B]reast inspi[R]e.
The gods th[A]t saw the goo[D]
That mortal{S} did approve,
{W}ith kind and holy mood
Began to talk of Love.
...................................
. <= 11 =>
.
. D i d q u i c k [E] n m
. a n's c o n c e [I] t,A
. n d w o m e n's [B] r e
. a s t i n s p i [R] e.T
. h e g o d s t h [A] t s
. a w t h e g o o [D] T h
. a t m o r t a l {S} d i
. d a p p r o v e,{W} i t
. h k i n d a n d h o l
. y m o o d
.
[{W.S.} DARBIE] -11 : Prob. in song ~ 1 in 3,650,000
.......................................................
But during this accord,
A wonder *STRANGE* to hear,
Whilst Love in deed and word
Most faithful did appear,
False-semblance came in place,
By Jealousy attended,
And with a double face
Both love and fancy blended;
Which made the gods forsake,
And men from fancy fly,
And maidens scorn a make,
Forsooth, and so *WILL I*.
..................................................
. Epilogue _ROSALYNDE OR, EUPHUES' GOLDEN LEGACY_
.
If you grace me with that favor, you encourage
me to be more forward; and as soon as I have
overlooked my labors, expect the Sailor's Calendar.
.
. *T. LODGE. FINIS*
---------------------------------------------------------------
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Lodge

<<THOMAS LODGE (1558 - September 1625) was an English dramatist.
He was born at West HAM, the second son of Sir Thomas Lodge,
who was Lord Mayor of the City of London in 1562-1563.

Young Thomas served as *PAGE* to the Stanleys, Earls of Derby,
until approximately 1571, when he enrolled in the
Merchant-Taylors' School. From there he went on to
Trinity College, Oxford, where he took his degree in 1577.>>
---------------------------------------------------
david kathman wrote:

<<In 1596, *THOMAS LODGE* in his *WITS MISERy* mentioned
the "ghost which cried so MISERably at the Theatre,
*like an OISTER-WIFE*, 'HAMlet, REVEnge'.">>
------------------------------------------------------
In his Frontline essay, William Murphy
mentions *THOMAS LODGE* once and only once:
.........................................................
Thirty-Six Plays in Search of an Author
by William M. Murphy, Union College Symposium 1964
.............................................................
There are those, like Delia Bacon, who are afflicted with what
has been called the "Corporation Syndrome," holding that such
distinguished literature must be the work of a commi[T]tee.
Its members wou[L]d include, in additi[O]n to BACON and Oxfor[D],
Robert GREENE, Geor[G]e PEELE, Samuel DANI[E]L, Thomas NASHE,
*THOMAS LODGE*, Michael Drayton, and Thomas Dekker.
....................................................
_________ <= 17 =>
.
. m u s t b e t h e w o r k o f a c
. o m m i [T] t e e.I t s m e m b e r
. s w o u [L] d i n c l u d e,i n a d
. d i t i [O] n t o B a c o n a n d O
. x f o r [D] R o b e r t G r e e n e,
. G e o r [G] e P e e l e,S a m u e l
. D a n i [E] l,T h o m a s N a s h e,
.*T H O M A S L O D G E*

[T.LODGE] 17 : Prob. stuck on *THOMAS LODGE* ~ 1 in 100,000
-----------------------------------------------------
Henry IV, Part 1 (Quarto 1, 1598) Act I, scene iii
.
EARL OF WORCESTER: Peace coosen, say no more.
. And now *I WILL UNCLASPE a SECRET BOOKE* ,
. And to your quicke conceiuing discontents
. Ile read[E] you matter deepe and daun[G]erous,
. As full of perill an[D] aduenterous spirit,
. As to [O]rewalke a Current roring [L]owd,
. On the vnstedfast foo[T]ing of a *SPEARE*.
....................................................
____ <= 22 =>

. *U N C L A S P E a S E C R E T B O O K E*, A n
. d t o y o u r q u i c k e c o n c e i u i n
. g d i s c o n t e n t s I l e r e a d[E] y o
. u m a t t e r d e e p e a n d d a u n[G] e r
. o u s,A s f u l l o f p e r i l l a n[D] a d
. u e n t e r o u s s p i r i t,A s t o[O] r e
. w a l k e a C u r r e n t r o r i n g[L] o w
. d,O n t h e v n s t e d f a s t f o o[T] i n
. g o f a*S P E A R E*.

[T LODGE] -22 (one of 6 *SPEARE*s) (only *SECRET BOOKE*)
----------------------------------------------------------
Sketch Book of Geoffrey Crayon, Gent. by Washington Irving.
http://www.bartleby.com/109/6.html

THE MUTABILITY OF LITERATURE.
A COLLOQUY IN WESTMINSTER ABBEY.

I had taken down a little thick quarto, curiously bound in
parchment, with brass *CLASPS*, and seated myself at the table
in a venerable elbow-chair. Instead of reading, howEVER, I was
beguiled by the solemn monastic air and lifeless quiet of the
place, into a train of musing. As I looked around upon the old
volumes in their mouldering covers, thus ranged on the shelves
and apparently nEVER disturbed in their repose, I could not but
consider the library a kind of literary catacomb, where authors,
like mummies, are piously entombed and left to blacken and
moulder in dusty oblivion.

While I sat half-murmuring, half-meditating, these unprofitable
speculations with my head resting on my hand, I was thrumming
with the other hand upon the quarto, until I accidentally
loosened the *CLASPS*; when, to my utter astonishment, the
little book gave two or three yawns, like one awaking from
a *DEEP* sleep, then a husky hem, and at length began to talk.
............................................................
“Ah,” said the little quarto, with a heavy sigh, “I see how it is;
these modern scribblers have superseded all the good old authors.
I suppose nothing is read now-a-days but Sir Philip Sydney’s Arcadia,
Sackville’s stately plays, and Mirror for Magistrates, or the fine-
spun euphuisms of the ‘unparalleled John Lyly.”’

“There you are again mistaken,” said I; “the writers whom you sup{P}ose
in vogue, because they happened to be so when y{O}u were last in
circulation, have long since had th{E}ir day. [S]ir *Philip SYDNEY’s*
Arcadia, the [I]mmortali{T}y of which was so fon[D]ly predicted by his
admirer{S}, a[N]d which, in truth, is full of nobl[E] thoughts, delicate
images, and graceful turns of language, is now scarcely [E]ver
me[N]tione[D]. Sackv[I]lle ha[S] strutted into obscurity; and even Lyly,
though his writings were once the delight of a court, and apparently
perpetuated by a proverb, is now scarcely known even by name.

{POETS} 41
[SIDNE] -6,26
............................................................
"My very good sir," said the little quarto, yawning most drearily
in my face, "excuse my interrupting you, but I perceive you are
rather given to prose. I would ask the fate of an author who
was making some noise just as I left the world. His reputation,
however, was considered quite temporary. The learned sho{O}k
their head{S} at him, for he was a poor, half-[E]ducated varle{T},
that knew little of Lati[N], and nothing of Gr{E}ek, and had been
oblige[D] to run the country f{O}r deer-stealing. I th[I]nk his
name was Shakes{P}eare. I presume he [S]oon sunk into oblivion."
.......................................................................
. <= 35 =>
.
. T h e l e a r n e d s h o{O}k t h e i r h e a d{S}a t h i m,f o r h e
. w a s a p o o r,h a l f[E]d u c a t e d v a r l e{T}t h a t k n e w l
. i t t l e o f L a t i[N]a n d n o t h i n g o f G r{E}e k,a n d h a d
. b e e n o b l i g e[D]t o r u n t h e c o u n t r y f{O}r d e e r-s t
. e a l i n g.I t h[I]n k h i s n a m e w a s S h a k e s{P}e a r e.I p
. r e s u m e h e[S]o o n s u n k i n t o o b l i v i o n."

{POETS} -36
[SIDNE] -34
.......................................................................
"On the contrary," said I, "it is owing to that *VERy man* that
the literature of his period has experienced a duration beyond the
ordinary term of English literature. There rise authors now and
then who seem proof against the mutability of language because
they have rooted themselves in the unchanging principles of
human nature. They are like gigantic trees that we sometimes
see on the banks of a stream, which by their vast and *DEEP* roots,
penetrating through the mere surface and laying hold on the VERy
foundations of the earth, preserve the soil around them from
being swept away by the EVER-flowing current, and hold up many
a neighboring plant, and perhaps WORTHless WEED, to perpetuity.
Such is the case with Shakespeare, whom we behold defying the
encroachments of time, retaining in modern use the language and
literature of his day, and giving duration to many an indifferent
author, merely from having flourished in his vicinity. But even
he, I grieve to say, is gradually assuming the tint of age,
and his whole form is overrun by a profusion of commentators,
who, like clambering vines and creepers, almost
*bury the NOBLE plant* that upholds them."
.........................................................
{W}hat (D)reary waste{S} of m(E)taphysics! H[E]re a(N)d there o(N)ly
[D]o we behold th(E) he[A]ven-illumine(D) ba[R]ds, elevated like
[B]eacons on their w[I]dely-separated h[E]ights, to transmit
the pure light of poetical intelligence from age to age."

I was just about to launch *FORTH* into eulogiums upon the poets
of the day, when the sudden opening of the door caused me to
turn my head. It was the VERgEr, who came to inform me that
it was time to close the library. I sought to have a parting
word with the quarto, but the worthy little tome was silent;
the *CLASPS* were closed: and it looked perfectly
unconscious of all that had passed.
.........................................................
. <= 15 =>
.
. {W} h a t(D)r e a r y w a s t e
. {S} o f m(E)t a p h y s i c s!H
. [E] r e a(N)d t h e r e o(N)l y
. [D] o w e b e h o l d t h(E)h e
. [A] v e n-i l l u m i n e(D)b a
. [R] d s,e l e v a t e d l i k e
. [B] e a c o n s o n t h e i r w
. [I] d e l y-s e p a r a t e d h
. [E] i g h t s,t o t r a n s m i
. t t h e p u r e l i g h t o f
. p (O)e t i c a l i n t e l l i
. g (E)n c e f r o m a g e t o a
. g e.
.
(NED) -15,15 : Prob. both in array ~ 1 in 150
[{W.S.} E.DARBIE] 15
.
Prob. of [{W.S.} E.DARBIE] in last 2 sentences ~ 1 in 57,000,000.
----------------------------------------------------------------
http://hollowaypages.com/jonson1692underwoods.htm

U N D E R - W O O D S.
Consisting of divers P O E M S.
By Ben. Johnson.

A Hymn to God the Father.

For, sins so sweet,
As minds ill bent
Rarely repent,
Until they meet
Their [P]unishment.

Wh[O] more can crav[E]
Than thou has[T] done?
That gav'[S]t a Son,
To free a Slave:
First made of nought;
Withall since bought.

[POETS] 12
----------------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer
nordicskiv2
2018-02-18 01:15:55 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
-------------------------------------------------------
I first got excited about Oxfordian ciphers
Your eagerness to share the origin of your psychopathology with anonymous strangers online is touching, Art, but nothing is gained by the practice of parading your illness oVER and oVER and oVER and oVER and oVER and oVER.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
from reading
Really?! When did you learn to do that, Art? You demonstrably cannot now, so you must have promptly forgotten how.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
about two amazing
There is nothing "amazing" about either one, Art.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
(anonymous)
Well, of course: no sane or competent anagrammatist would be caught dead in a ditch with either one!
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
near anagrams
"Near anagrams" are for incompetents who cannot find *real* anagrams, Art.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
------------------------------------------------
. OUR EVER-LIVIN(g)
. VERO NIL VERIU(s)
That's not an anagram, Art.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
. ENVIOU(s) SLIVER
. NIL VE(r)O VERIUS
That's not an anagram either, Art.

[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
*GROS(s)ER NAME* : *ENVIOU(s) SLIVER*
*ROGE(r) MANERS* : *NIL VE(r)O VERIUS*
Neither of those is an anagram either, Art. So far, you're batting aVERage is zero, although your batty aVERage is impressive.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
----------------------------­-------------­-----------
But it dawned on me that [the Roper] array also contains
[Crackpot cryptography snipped]
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
I believe that Oxford wrote the (self referential) Hamlet 1603 Quarto
What is "self referential" about it, Art? You have neVER answered this.

[Moronic nonsense snipped]
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
*AND MORE STRANGE RE(t)URN*.' 'HAMLET.'
......................................
_ *AND MORE STRANGE RE(t)URN*
_ *ROGER MANNERS, E. RUT(l)AND*
That's not an anagram either, Art! Your batting aVERage is *still* zero!

Besides, when it came to Rutting, Oxford was not known as a roger-manner but as a roger-boyer.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
<<However, since John de Vere [13th Earl] helped Richmond become Henry VII
(and thus start the House of Tudor) Elizabeth was OK with him being recognized
in Shakespeare (along with Sir William Stanley: the ancestor of William
Stanley, 6th Earl of Derby: Edward de Vere's son-in-law and probably
coauthor of the [W.S]hakespeare canon).
......................................................
<<There is no more evidence of William Stanley's involvement
in the Shakespeare canon than there is of Edward de Vere's, Art.>>
There is *MORE* cipher evidence of [W]illiam [S]tanley's involvement
There is *no* credible cipher evidence of either one, Art, so your claim that there is more for Stanley than for de Vere is tenable *only if* "more" is interpreted as "greater than or equal"; indeed, 0≥0 is true, while 0>0 is not.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
Was *THOMAS LODGE* the *PAGE* that served W.S.'s WIT?
No, Art. I've answered this question before, but your memory is as dysfunctional as your comprehension.

[Crackpot cryptography snipped]
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
. p{LE(a)SANT WILLY}
. {WILL STANLEY}
That isn't even remotely close to being an anagram, Art! MoreoVER, even a child who can count to 12 can refute it effortlessly.

While I feel sure that there must be many remedial reading courses available to adult illiterates in your area, I don't know about the availability of remedial kindergarten arithmetic classes; howeVER, you should perseVERE until you find one that will accept you, Art.
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
______ <= 49 =>
.
. Allplacest h {E/Y} withfolliehavepossestAndwithvainetoy
. esthevulga r [E] entertaineButmehavebanishedwithallthe
. restThatwh i [L] omewonttowaituponmytraineFineCounterf
. esaunceand {U}[N] hurtfullSportDelightandLaughterdeckti
. nseemlysor {T}[A] lltheseandallthatelsthecomickstageWit
. hseasonedw i [T] andgoodlypleasancegracedBywhichmansli
. feinhislik e [S] timageWaslimnedFORTHarewhollynowdefac
. edAndthose s [W] eetewitswhichwonttheliketoframeArenow
. despizdand m a dealaughinggame
.
The string "WSTANLEY" does not appear as an equidistant letter sequence of skip -49 -- or indeed, as an equidistant letter sequence of *any* skip -- in the text above, Art.

You should not let the extreme urgency of finding a remedial kindergarten arithmetic class distract you from the equal urgency of finding an adult remedial reading class, Art.

[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
U N D E R - W O O D S.
What was under Oxford's woods was generally one of this boys in his entourage, Art.

[Lunatic logorrhea snipped]
Post by Arthur Neuendorffer
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Art Neuendorffer (aka Noonedafter)
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